here's a post , I think it is helpful in the dialogue of Christology.
a friend from England was asking some christological questions ,
http://www.monachos.net/forum/showth...1099#post61099
his questions were mixing and confusing the nature and person , so, he was some how puzzled ... a Roman Catholic father replied to him with the next Quotation
Quotation:
False. You are confusing person and nature. The divine nature of Jesus subsists in the divine hypostasis.
, and then I posted the following Reply :
this point is very important point . thanks father Alvin.
and if I can contribute with some words for the points and inquiries mentioned by brother John Uebersax.
Based on the book of Saint John of Damascus on the Economy of incarnation , I want to say that he achieved a great step in gathering all Patristic christology within defining their terms.
one of the usual problems in understanding theology is in confusing or mixing the concept of nature with the concept of Person. st. John of Damascus discusses these terms from a Greek aspect : Nature or essence (ousia) is the common characteristics between us . example : Paul and Peter where both Humans ... u cannot distinguish peter from paul through nature. but the person is the unique stamp . Peter is not Paul because Peter is that the one who has the name Peter (the one who likes certain foods and is married and preaches the gospel for Jews ... etc.) ,
Jesus is not a name of nature but is the name of the person who possesses the divine and the human natures united together.
so, we do not distinguish between jesus or the Logos , but Jesus is thr Logos ... that person who was born from the father before all the times and from Mary the virgin in history.
so, it is better for any one who wanna understand the mystery of incarnation , is to avoid the mixing of "nature : some thing" and the "person = some one " . for example : my hand does not love ... but Mina who possesses that hand loves God.
so, back to our topic ,
one of the problems of the fifth and sixth centuries is that the heterodox (Nestorians and Monophysites ) shared the same concept of nature , that is , Nature cannot live without a person .
from this we had two heretic conclusions :
1- Nestorian : since there are two natures , then there are two persons and consequently , Mary is not the mother of God (Theotokos) (look at the second part of the reply of Nestorius on St. Cyril of Alexandria)
2- Monophysite : since there is one person , then we should say one nature and consequently we cannot confess that Christ is consubstantial with us through his manhood.
both conclusions are not based on holy Tradition but on pure greek philosophy (Aristotle and Plato ) . but the true is that there are two natures and there is one person too !! how? the Nestorians could not bear the second part because they claimed that the natures are just (Conjoined) , so , there are two persons. and the Monophysites, as Severus says, believe in one nature from two natures then there is one Person from two Persons (look at his letter to Nyphalius "one Hypostasis from two Hypostases") and to get a single person , they sacrificed - Practically - Christ's human nature to solve their own dilemma.
but the Orthodox faith down the centuries , believes that the two natures are United Hypostatically "Henwsis Hypostatiky " and naturally "kata Physis" as Saint Cyril teaches along with the council of Ephesus 431, which means that the second person came from heaven and took the second nature from the holy virgin and united it with it ... not absorbed it nor conjuncted with it ... i.e. he did not take a person , or even the human nature had a person or even the human nature was formed before union with divine nature. there was no time for the human nature to have a person .. so, saint Leontius of Byzantium in his reply to Severus the anti-Chalcedonian , told him all this explanation with a beautiful word : enhypostasis. which means that the human nature existed inside the hypostasis of the second person of trinity. it was enhypostasized. the hypostasis of the Logos gathered another nature and united it physically with his divine one in an ineffable way. these natures are 'things' ... united inside the one and same one who was born from God and from Mary the Panagia.
this leads us to use the term "communication of idioms = Communicatio idiomatum" which means that the two natures are for one and same person , the Glory of divinity is for Jesus and the pain and death is also for jesus. that's what saint Leo the great in his Tome -along with saint Cyril the great- described by saying : "it is fitting to say that the Son of God died and crucified." and sure that death happened for the Logos through his own (idiotys) flesh ... not the flesh of anyone.
I hope this could help
I'm glad to begin my posts in the topic led me to Join the Orthodox church!
and please if any one felt or found any inaccurate term or sentence or concept within my words , please correct it .
in Christ,
Minas
http://www.orthodoxonline.org/forum/...2008/03/75.jpg
"
Therefore, following the holy fathers, we all with one accord teach men to acknowledge one and the same Son, our Lord Jesus Christ, at once complete in Godhead and complete in manhood, truly God and truly man, consisting also of a reasonable soul and body; of one substance with the Father as regards his Godhead, and at the same time of one substance with us as regards his manhood; like us in all respects, apart from sin; as regards his Godhead, begotten of the Father before the ages, but yet as regards his manhood begotten, for us men and for our salvation, of Mary the Virgin, the God-bearer; one and the same Christ, Son, Lord, Only-begotten, recognized in two natures, without confusion, without change, without division, without separation; the distinction of natures being in no way annulled by the union, but rather the characteristics of each nature being preserved and coming together to form one person and subsistence, not as parted or separated into two persons, but one and the same Son and Only-begotten God the Word, Lord Jesus Christ; even as the prophets from earliest times spoke of him, and our Lord Jesus Christ himself taught us, and the creed of the fathers has handed down to us.
"
